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Posted By Leon Thomas about 11 months ago
Heart of Gaming: Miserablist,
Heart of Gaming: Miserablist
Leon tries to refute the idea that he enjoys being miserable by listing ways to improve the gaming landscape.
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Western RPGs are especially popular with female gamers like your humble obedient. I think this is largely because many of us like RPGs for the roleplaying aspect; that is, we want to strongly identify with the character we’re playing.
Female JRPG protagonists seem to a Western female to be weak, shrill, and annoying. Any power they’re given in the game mechanics must be offset by shy body language or squeaky temper tantrums. Don’t even start me on their clothes.
In contrast, Western RPGs allow me to invent my own character of either gender, choose their outfits, and choose their response to a given situation; if I want to identify with a female, I can be Shepard or the Dovakiin. I’m not forced into the Pretty Swooning Sparkle Magic role.
Persona 4. Your argument is invalid.
Also JRPGs are really popular with girls. Do I really have to explain why? http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/cit_ouran_high_bishonen.jpg
Persona 4′s protagonist appears to be a teenage boy. I’m willing to be corrected on that point.
I like bishis, too. It’s not worth putting up with Aerith and Tifa and their sisterhood for x number of hours to play with them, though.
The audio in this video sounds kinda bad.
The gaming industry is going to make whatever is making the most money. When FF7 was so popular they produced so many JRPGs. Now the JRPGs are losing it’s apeal people are turning away from them.
Today people just want simple games which is sad. That is why we have a ton of FPS.
In response to your question of “where are all the JRPGs”, the answer is in the portable gaming arena. If you check out the library for Nintendo DS and Playstation Portable you will find a HUGE amount of JRPGs, both continuing franchises and completely new franchises. Final Fantasy & Dragon Quest both have high quality remakes on these systems as well as new entries into their line-up. Some may scoff at the concept of portable gaming, but it’s not really that much different, you can even buy A/V cables should you wish to hook up these systems to a TV and play them. Oh and as for the DS, most of the JRPGs on them don’t have funky stylus driven gameplay, so you can enjoy them with a good old-fashioned controller. Part of the big reason I’ve not gone over to the 3DS or Vita yet is because all the big launch titles are dumbed down entries from PS3/Nintendo franchises, and not high quality RPGs.
just to add, I know you said you didn’t like portables, but the thing is we’ve gone away from the days of the first Gameboy, there is a narrowing gap, as I mentioned all current portables can be hooked into a TV with a cheap (less than 5$) attachment that turns your portable gaming console into a controller.
As for the RPGs, I am a fan of both western and JRPGs but I feel they both suffer the same problems, lack of GOOD narrative, it’s a bit unfair to say Western RPGs lack story, most of them have one, but just like JRPGs, few are good, they all recycle the same old “Kill the big bad, save the world” mantra, with rarely a twist thrown in, all double-crosses are seen right from the character introductions and any dark secret pasts are readily evident by the lack of backstory. Western RPGs are good in that they offer variety for your replays, you never play an Elder Scrolls game the same way, where-as JRPGs have some of the most exotic and impressive locations and creatures, I am still blown away by Final Fantasy XII’s locations. What I would truly like to see is a dissolving between the differences and see a game that truly blends both Japanese and Western RPG concepts together, I’ve seen some slight headway in this direction with western RPGs taking on anime-esque visuals (Kingdoms of Amalur) and with JRPGs going for a more open ended approach with tons of sidequests (Dragon Quest IX) but we’re a long way off.
I have to disagree on JRPG’s. I think that genre has basically hung itself at this point. All the things you pointed to as positives in your video, Leon, I consider horrible, tired cliches. And the worst part is that where JRPG’s where once innocent and fun, well, now there’s all this… ehhh… baggage being thrown in. Like underage girls used for sex appeal. Don’t believe me? Play Star Ocean: The Last Hope. I don’t like that crap in my games, and I don’t give a fig if it’s in there because of different cultural standards or whatever.
On the other hand, you have made some fair points about Western RPG’s. Too many of them drop you into this vast, enormous world… where there are few surprises and everything becomes stale long before you complete the game.
Hey, we should appreciate cultural standards because they’re hilarious. Like how we love games with the freedom to slaughter and plunder NPCs. But jailbait? That’s when we’re like, “All we did was sneak into homes stabbing townspeople in their sleep for innocent, clean fun. Then those disgusting perverts did the unthinkable and oggled at an underage girl! I will not tolerate such rampant depravity, good day sir!” and drive off on a stolen car running over 20 cops. Fictional morality should never stop being that funny.
I agree with everything you said except for PC games. I like steam, but I can’t afford a gaming PC, and not everyone can. I know it’s multi-use, but I got my PS3 for 250 dollars… a gaming desktop runs upward of 800 dollars, not even counting the monitor and all the accessories you have to buy for it. Outside of small indie games I can play on my current hardware, I feel like crack would be cheaper. Also, nothing beats the comfort of snuggling up on the couch with a controller in hand and a big screen tv in front of you.
But you nailed my feelings on western RPGs. I’ve played JRPGs since I was a kid. Then they started thinning out. I tried western RPGs and they bored me. Being your own protagonist and making up your own “do whatever the fuck you want” story just doesn’t hold a candle to crafted yes, dare I say it, LINEAR writing. I think it’s dumb that linear has become a bad word in gaming, yet everyone is clamoring for the style of old games. Gee, no wonder developers are confused.
I hope we get a Catherine 2. Have you tried professor layton? I know you said you dislike handhelds (and I agree with your reasonings, I find them uncomfortable too) but that’s an excellent puzzle series. Also, try the Trauma Center games on the wii. They’re weird puzzle/surgeon simulator games made by Atlus. Your pronunciation of “Persona” made me giggle by the way.
Anyway great episode! I can’t wait until next week.
D’oh. I think you’re right. I did say it that way for some reason. I know I should say “Per-Sone-Uh” instead of “Per-Sahn-Uh” but speaking in my character’s back-of-the-throat voice sometimes screws up my speech.
I can’t play Layton on handhelds, but I did recently inherit a Trauma Center game by way of someone moving in with me who has tons of games. I honestly didn’t even know it was a puzzle game. I’ll check it out some day.
I don’t agree about PC’s being “easier”. Sure it would be nice if everything was on one box but not if it’s a PC. Know why? Different builds. One computer can play a game another can’t, or plays it with bugs and glitches. This is something the defiled pc gaming race can’t escape.
They are thinking of making Catherine a franchise though, which is interesting.
You can try the video game of “Game of thrones” as western RPG. Tecnically is terrible, but it have an incredibly good story, some innovative idea and mechanics… and a really mature and hard approach to the story and the “choices”.
Torture, rape, vengiance, betrayals, religions, long loading… you can have a good tase of all the bad things in human history
PS: anyway JRP with all the grinding and repetitive combat and situation are much more “singleplayer MORPG” in the mechanic.
Yet another great episode! I agree with what you said about portable consoles having exclusives being silly and I do think there should be more JRPGs because, even though I prefer western choose your own adventure style RPGs, it’s sad to see a group of gamers not get their type of game.
Gotta say that I do completely agree with this. Great points with great explanation.
I honestly like western rpgs, I think the games from Bioware are a nice blend of story telling and having your own character with their own decisions. Albeit it’s NO where near perfect, I mean all of Bioware’s stories have come down to; You’re special person of a special small organization and you have to defeat the big bad. How it’s told is somewhat unique I’ll give them that, and the whole being good vs. bad is very elementary (but I think DA was the best about this). Anyway I do like WRPGs cause they have a lot of exploration but lack that sense of storytelling unless you can find a good questline and even then your character has as much ‘character’ as a silent JRPG one.
I always loved JRPGs. I think the last really good one I played was Lost Odyssey, I loved that one. I also played Dragon Warrior IX on the DS and also still going through Radiant Historia. But those are DS titles and meh. I have zero faith in FF these days, I just can’t care to finish XII still and I got it on realease. Never bothered with XIII or XIII-2 (really?). I liked LO cause of the characters and even if it was a melodramatic fest I still loved the storytelling. Well at least we have The Last Story to look forward to…right?
Where’s some Mirror’s Edge 2? Seriously I agree on that. Yeah we got Portal 2, fine and good but man… amongst the COD and AC a year games or just sequals it would be nice for something different.
I also feel like companies are either trying WAY too hard or not trying at all when creating their games, whether is story, design or gameplay. Granted I get the whole why they just continue on a franchise than work on a new IP. It’s the fault on the company and consumer, blah blah blah. But be nice for the companies to have some backbone.
You say puzzle franchises don’t exist today. I take it you haven’t played the Professor Layton series.
“Franchises”… as in plural. Prof Layton is just one game series, not exactly one among many like him ( Is that a good or a bad thing?).
But there are. The Trauma Center games are essentially puzzle games. Cooking Mama? Maybe? Ivy the Kiwi (I know it’s not a franchise but still) is kind of a puzzle platformer. Brain Age I think has more than one game.
Humm… I don’t know… it would seem that Puzzle games can be interpreted in a wide variety of ways.
Which means Leon is right, the more there are the less confusing it will be to properly distinguish them. The problem is that such games usually fall into bargain bins or are labelled “Shovelware”. I’m sure you guys know a lot of games like that that don’t deserve that title.
Absolute valid points there Leon, but I like western RPGs. I like being able to build my own character not just someone’s vision on the protagonist.
I like being able to make my own character too! Spending hours getting the face just right then choosing some cool looking hair, hell even downloading some mods to make them look cooler!
Then not seeing all that hardwork because the camera angle is ALWAYS behind the character and you are usually wearing a full suit of armor with a helmet on so you can’t even see that cool hair style I downloaded.
So yeah. Fun?
This is where I think a good compromise between JRPGs and Western could be made, granted I don’t want the JRPG style of “nothing you wear changes your character model unless it’s a fanservice-y female outfit” but I like how much face-time and character development is given to JRPG protagonists, if we could have more of this in a game that gives you total customization over a character, then I would be happy. I’d also like to see character creation become something more than just visuals, why not choose a personality type? So you can play through a game as either a badass with a dark past, or as your typical emo prettyboy common to JRPGs, I think creating a character should involve more than just your face.
I think what you may like is called Dragon Quest 9 Sentinels of the Starry Skies.
It’s pretty awesome.
Oh and my above comment, yeah I was making fun of western RPGs but I like them too.
I agree with you on pretty much everything, although I don’t think that “choose your own adventure”-type games are necessarily boring.
You lied to me! You said this would be a horrible episode, and it wasn’t! Now I am disappointed! ZERO STARS!
Sooo World of Goo 2, The gooining right? Ya I would play that.
I would like to see a modern day version of T.I.M. (The Incredible Machine) Don’t know it? Look it up I played it through dosbox not to long ago.
AAAAAAAAnyway, it would be a enlightenment if some console exclusive gaming company would at least start to bring their titles on the PC too. I am a PC man, simply because I do not want to spend money on a console while I have a PC already, but I would play the shit out of say…… uhm, a new Zelda if they released it on pc.
The episode was okay, I THINK I could see that you had problems with it though, but you know, it can’t be Samhain everyday.
I would have to agree with every single “thing” on this list. I only own a console for the exclusives anymore, handhelds on something other than a handheld would be nice, and Jesus in Heaven where are the JRPGs? D:
Hear, hear! After Tales of Graces f (Which I literally -just- finished, minutes before writing this.), there aren’t any notable JRPGs coming out in the near future until Ni No Kuni, which will only come out -next- year. I really don’t want that genre to die!
While definitely a sad state of events, Ni no Kuni is one of the best JRPGs in like 5 years. I hope it sells well because it certainly deserves to.